Cross-ref formats

Tue Aug 4 15:38:02 PDT 2009

It sounds to me like we're all discussing the same philosophy: That things
should be easy, controllable, and understandable.

If a print paradigm is most comfortable, then create books with chapters &
the requisite # of headings.

If topic-based authoring seems most straightforward, then go that route.
AFIK, all the tools one might consider will give a nod to print (Word, PDF,
and good ol' File > Print), to Help output, and to structure via DITA or
another model.

I've always preached that the xrefs should be complete units where possible.
This allows for consistency and accuracy in entering them, and for better
understanding, albeit less variety, for the end user.

Now that documentation=printed/PDF manuals=Help=training, the ability to
manage xref formats from 1 template per output is (for me & my clients)is
non-negotiable. I choose to limit the choices in xref formats to the
minimum, mapping to appropriate formats for various outputs (read as "on
import to RoboHelp")

I limit my formatting to 95% of what I want to keep my doc's under control,
rather than jumping thru the endless hoops needed to achieve 100% of what
others perceive as "perfect"

-Matt

Matt Sullivan
GRAFIX Training

matt at grafixtraining.com
www.grafixtraining.com
office 714 960-6840
cell & txt 714 585-2335
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-----Original Message-----
From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Sharon Burton
Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 1:48 PM
To: 'Mike Feimster'; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Cross-ref formats

Right now she's doing print. But in 6 months? I like to build for this
possibility. 

And I'm lazy and don't want to have to worry about what template is applied
and checking the xref formats to make sure it's all as it should be and... 

I'm not saying Nancy is wrong, I'm just giving my philosophy on what I
prefer to do.

sharon

Sharon Burton
IM: sharonvburton at yahoo.com
951-369-8590

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Feimster [mailto:mike.feimster at acstechnologies.com]
Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 1:33 PM
To: sharon at anthrobytes.com; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Cross-ref formats

Considering she's setting up a template for a print document, it makes sense
to include the page numbers in the x-ref formats.

If she's outputting to a different format, she can create a separate set of
x-ref definitions in the tool she is using to create her other output.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Sharon Burton
Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 4:18 PM
To: 'Nancy Allison'; framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: RE: Cross-ref formats

Given that more and more information is being repurposed, I've become
against making things fit the old printed model. 

The xref formats you describe are from print. But I'm thinking more and more
of formatting and content as separate. 

I would set the xrefs as simple as possible in Frame to handle other
outputs. 

But that's just me. I'd rather not have writers trying to figure out what to
use when and I'd really like to not have checking these formats in the
preproduction list. 

sharon

Sharon Burton
IM: sharonvburton at yahoo.com
951-369-8590

-----Original Message-----
From: framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com
[mailto:framers-bounces at lists.frameusers.com] On Behalf Of Nancy Allison
Sent: Tuesday, August 04, 2009 12:52 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: Re: Cross-ref formats

Some follow-up questions:

1. I've been looking at the Chicago Manual, 15th edition. I'd expect a great
honking treatment of this subject, but I'm not seeing it. All the
cross-reference i9nformation is presented with reference to indexes and
bibliographies. The sections referring to cross-references "in text" are
discussions of the editor's obligation to check cross-references!

Is there an exhaustive section on x-ref format, in text, that I'm missing?

2. I'm shocked, shocked, I tell you , to discover just what a
stick-in-the-mud I really am. I thought italics were sacrosanct for
referring to the titles of separately bound publications. (Although how
purely electronic publications can be "bound" is a topic for another
day.)
But .. . you've all gotten over this hurdle and use italics to identify
cross-references? Like:  "See <open italics> Pots and Pans <close
italics>
on page 85," where "Pots and Pans" is a couple of paragraphs with header in
a much longer chapter of a much larger *separately bound* publication,
whether physical or digital?

Really?

I must sit down.

In that case, do you also put your italicized x-refs in a different color,
so as to distinguish them from the titles of separately bound publications,
which you might also mention in your text? 

Thanks!

--Nancy

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