[Framers] OT: Reference question

[Harding, Dan]

But why even reference the original article? Doesn't the revised/republished article supplant the former entirely, so just cite it? I've not seen this type of recursive citing before. Seems extraneous to me.

-Dan



-----Original Message-----
From: Framers <framers-bounces+dharding=illinois.edu at lists.frameusers.com> On Behalf Of Jeff Coatsworth
Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2021 6:42 AM
To: An email list for people using Adobe FrameMaker software. <framers at lists.frameusers.com>
Subject: Re: [Framers] OT: Reference question

I've never seen an embedded reference in all my years in university. I would have thought that the second one would have just quoted the title of the first one - e.g.


Rodgers, T., Leahy, D., et al. (2007). "Rodgers T, Leahy D, Rowland M. 2005.
Physiologically based pharmacokinetic modeling 1: Predicting the tissue distribution of moderate-to-strong bases." J Pharm Sci 94(6): 1259-76.


and ditched the first location - IMHO, that's not part of the title of the second article.


________________________________
From: Framers <framers-bounces+jeff.coatsworth=jonasclub.com at lists.frameusers.com> on behalf of tammyvb at spectrumwritingllc.com <tammyvb at spectrumwritingllc.com>
Sent: September 28, 2021 5:16 PM
To: framers at lists.frameusers.com
Subject: [Framers] OT: Reference question

OK, I know this is off-topic but because this list is filled with seasoned veterans of technical writing, I know I can get my answer here. I am working on the references for a client document, and have to sort through the existing references that I was given and make sure it is accurate, current, etc., and I came across a couple of instances of a reference within a reference such as:



Rodgers, T., Leahy, D., et al. (2005). "Physiologically based pharmacokinetic modeling 1: predicting the tissue distribution of moderate-to-strong bases." J Pharm Sci 94(6): 1259-76.



Rodgers, T., Leahy, D., et al. (2007). "Rodgers T, Leahy D, Rowland M. 2005.
Physiologically based pharmacokinetic modeling 1: Predicting the tissue distribution of moderate-to-strong bases. J Pharm Sci 94:1259-1276." J Pharm Sci 96(11): 3151-3152.



You can see that the first reference is embedded/cited in the second reference. This was not the way that I was taught a gazillion years ago to cite an embedded reference. Basically, if the content of the embedded reference was standalone in a new reference, regardless of the source, then the new reference was all that was cited, for example:



Rodgers, T., Leahy, D., et al. (2007). Physiologically based pharmacokinetic modeling 1: Predicting the tissue distribution of moderate-to-strong bases.
J Pharm Sci 96(11): 3151-3152.



I looked at these papers and the content was standalone in the second reference and it cited the first reference for the content, but because the content was standalone in the second reference, I should cite only the second reference where appropriate. (God, does that even make sense. . . I am thinking of the Friends episode, "The One Where Everybody Finds Out," and they don't know that we know that they know and Joey loses his mind.)



I just need some advice from some seasoned writers about how to handle this.



Thanks!



TVB








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